Specialist Arms Forum

Mordheim => [Mord] Discussion => Topic started by: Master on May 29, 2009, 09:10:08 PM

Title: Athel Loren: Hired Swords & Dramatis Personae
Post by: Master on May 29, 2009, 09:10:08 PM

So what we've got so far:

Feral Alter:
40gc to hire, 10gc upkeep + 10gc per wild cat.

May be hired: By wood elves, high elves and bretonnians.

Rating: +15 points, +5 points per cat, +1 per experience (s)he has.

M Ws Bs S T W I A LD Alter      6 4    4  3  3 1 5 1  8 Wild Cat 6 4    -   3  3 1 4 1  6

Weapons & Armour: The Alter carries a longbows, a sword, an elven cloak and a dagger. The cat carry nothing and need nothing.
He starts with 1 cat.

Beastmaster - All friendly animals within 6" may reroll all Leadership tests

Feral animals: Wild cats never gain experience. In addition if they are not within 6" of the alter at the start of the turn, they most roll a leadership test, if failed they will charge the nearest model, friend or foe.
Wild cats fear members of the alter kindred, and therefore they will never charge a member of the alter kindred, and will stop 1" away from them if attempting to do so. Each turn they are in combat with a member of the alter kindred, they will try to break from combat, and they wont fight back against them.

Cat Whisperer: In the post game section the alter may attempt to lure in another wild cat, to do so he must pass a leadership test, if succesfull he aquires a cat, if not he suffers 2s4 hits. As the cat attacks him before fleeing off. he may have no more than 3 cats at a time.

Pounce: When the wild cats charge they receive +1 attack.

---

Other ideas include, but are not limited to:
- Amber Mage
- Bestigor
- Bretonnian Faceless?? (The robin hood types of bretonnia).

Title: Re: Athel Loren: Hired Swords & Dramatis Personae
Post by: StyrofoamKing on May 29, 2009, 09:39:02 PM

Mage: Actually, I had the idea of making him a Druid character, with two spell lists.  The first one is an 'Amber' list, full of hth combat spells, while the 'Jade" list is more about healing and protective spells.  He starts with one spell from either list, but can choose which list as you go.  It's two HS in one!

Title: Re: Athel Loren: Hired Swords & Dramatis Personae
Post by: Master on May 30, 2009, 03:51:12 PM

A good idea, however it might be a little good, what if we do it like this:

Druid:
Some men are called to the wild like elves, and they use their ability to commune with nature to fight even the mightiest of foes, sometimes they aid travellers and residents of the forest.
May Be Hired: Elves + Bretonnia.
Hire fee: 40gc
Upkeep: 15gc

M WS BS S T W I A LD 4  4    3  3 3  1 4 1  8

Weapons and armour: Spear, club, dagger.
Skills: May take combat, strength or academic skills, may instead learn a spell from any of the lores below:

Amber: Roll D6
1. Panther's Leap: Same as the skaven spell black fury.
2. Anger of the beast: Same as the skaven spell eye of the warp.
3. Vision of terror: Same as the lesser magic spell dread of aramar.
4. Summon Squirrels: With this spell the Mage invokes the wrath of the Lord of Beasts, summoning forth dozens upon dozens of enraged squirrels. The furious rodents assault one enemy within 12" of the Mage, crawling inside the warrior’s clothing and armor, pelting him with nuts and causing numerous tiny bites and welts. The target suffers 2D6 Strength 1 hits. No armor saves allowed. Difficulty: 7
5. Rune of the true beast: This spell affects any animal within 12", if succesfully cast, the animal must roll a d6 and add its leadership, the mage does the same, if the mage scores higher the animal is under control of the mage. At the beginning of every shooting phase of the player controlling the mage, the animal is entitled to roll a leadership test, if succesful the control of the animal reverts to normal. Dif 8.
6. Bear companion: If succesful the mage gains a bear companion (stats can be seen below), it must be placed within 6" of him and will remain there for as long as both of them are on the table, if the mage is taken out of action the bear runs off, if the bear is taken out of action the mage may continue to fight, this spell must be tested at the start of the game and cannot be tested again. Dif. 6.
Bear Companion:

M WS BS S T W I  A LD 6  3    -  5  4 2  3 2  6

Jade: Roll D3:
1 Healing Hand, same as the sigmarite prayer.
2 Bright light of Judgement: This spell can be cast in two ways: Either offensively or defensively if cast offensively one undead or daemon model within 12" suffer one S5 hit. If cast defensively it can heal one wound from anything that isn't undead or daemon within 12" Dif 7.
3 Rejuvenation: This spell can be cast on any target within 2" of the mage or himself, each turn, in the recovery phase, he must pass a leadership test to keep this spell in effect, he can only keep one in effect at a time. The warrior which is blessed by this spell gains a 4+ special save, in addition in each recovery phase he may roll a D6 on 4+ he immediately regains one wound.
Dif 8
---

So What you say?

Title: Re: Athel Loren: Hired Swords & Dramatis Personae
Post by: StyrofoamKing on May 31, 2009, 04:44:47 PM

The bear one looks a little strong. I think there's a great Norse spell which pretty-much turns the caster into a bear (+2 s, +1 or 2 toughness, lowers Init to 1, need to test for Ld each turn to maintain... something like that.)

Title: Re: Athel Loren: Hired Swords & Dramatis Personae
Post by: Master on June 18, 2009, 11:04:28 PM

We could use that instead.

Also we were talking about a dryad HS, so whats the idea with that?

Title: Re: Athel Loren: Hired Swords & Dramatis Personae
Post by: StyrofoamKing on June 19, 2009, 01:28:08 PM

Looking at the spells again:
Rejuvination is pretty darn good. I'm wondering if it should be the Druid only.  If not, we have to specify whether it's maintained using the Druid's ld or the target's.

Bright Light of Judgement: approve of the spell, needs another name (sounds too much like a zealous 'sigmar' name).  Something with 'life' in the title, like "Summon Inner Life".

As for the missing two druid/jade spells, I'll try to post something soon.

Title: Re: Athel Loren: Hired Swords & Dramatis Personae
Post by: StyrofoamKing on June 19, 2009, 02:33:42 PM

4- Veil of Flowers - Diff Auto
The Druid summons a thick grove of flowers to hide his allies from prying eyes.  When deployed, the Druid covers all members of your warband within 12" with the flowers.  Each model cannot be shot at with spells or missiles until the model moves, shoots, or casts a spell.  If the Druid is 'Hunched' to a different part of the battlefield, he will only cover warband models within 12" of his deployed postion.

5 - Armor of Thorns - Dif 8
The Druid gains a 4+ armor save, which is modified as normal. In addition, all enemy models within base contact suffer an automatic Strength 1 hit at the beginning of each combat phase. Thorn strikes will never cause critical hits.  The Druid must pass a Leadership test at the start of each Shooting Phase to maintain it.

6 - Clutch of Vines - Diff 6
Target model within 12" finds himself twisted with vines and cannot move. At the end of the player's next turn, he may make a Strength test. If successful, the model is free to move again. If failed, he must test during the end of each of his turns.  This has no effect of the model's ability to shoot, cast spells, or fight in hand to hand (unless the spell involves him moving, in which case, he's still stuck to the ground.) If cast on a mounted model, it affects the mount, whilst the rider is unaffected (though you may use the rider's strength to break out, as he is aiding in the escape). Only one enemy model may be Clutched at any given point. You may end it by attempting to cast the spell again, or you may end it automatically at the start of any of your turns.

Title: Re: Athel Loren: Hired Swords & Dramatis Personae
Post by: Master on June 19, 2009, 11:47:22 PM

My thinking on rejuvenation was that it was like armour of righteousness, but it might need to improve in difficulty, it was meant to be on the leadership of the wizard.

Also, I like your spells.

I see what you mean about bright light needing another name, here are a few others which could be used:

Boon of life, Grants of jade, gift of life.

Also the veil of flowers isn't that good, and also need to be re-worded.

Also for the dryad here is a rough draft:

Dryad HS:
Hire ´40/20
may be hired by wood elves, or bowmen of bergerac.
M WS BS S T W I A LD
6   4   -  4 4  1 5 2 9
Weapons and armour: Dryads don't use weapons and armour apart from their natural weapons, if they roll criticals apply either bladed or bludgeoning criticals (choose before rolling).
Skills:
Combat, Strength, Speed.
Special Rules:
Cause fear, Immune to poison, Immune to psychology.
Part of nature: A dryad is in fact a part of the forest, and therefore it isn't slowed by any wooden feature for any reason.
Forest Spirit: Dryads have a 5+ special save (that can't be modified, that's why it's so special) against close combat or ranged attacks, this stacks with step aside/dodge for a 4+ save in the respective area.
Flammable: Dryads are made of wood and are therefore flammable, any flaming attack that hits them receives +1 strength, in addition even though they cause fear and are immune to psychology they will fear any warrior with a flaming weapon.

Reasoning: So it's like a pit fighter, but instead of weapons it gets another skill increase, therefore it has two starting skills, step aside and dodge, it also has immune to psychology and immune to poison, but these are countered by the flammable rule, the cause fear is countered by the increased cost.

Title: Re: Athel Loren: Hired Swords & Dramatis Personae
Post by: StyrofoamKing on June 20, 2009, 01:18:48 AM

Veil: You don't think so? We just had a player lose an Ogre and a hero in the first turn of the game (from a shooter), before he could even move. Hardly seemed sporting, and a veil to hide them seemed like a nice defensive idea. I've been wrong before, of course.

Dryad:  I like. Possible rule/skill: It may start the game in any tree terrain clump that is at least 12" from an enemy model not visible.  I like the idea of it 'popping' out of the woodworks, literally.

Title: Re: Athel Loren: Hired Swords & Dramatis Personae
Post by: ANSWER_MOD_DABANK on June 20, 2009, 12:25:43 PM

As Styro noted 12" is a very large range to remain hidden. This should be limited to like 2-4 inches, otherwise everyone will want to play them get the spell and infiltrate and or use hunch and big issues will arise. Nice idea, the Wood Elves in Warhammer Fantasy had something about a small forest being played anywhere on the table and it was a certain size. That works good for Warhammer due to the amount of models, this would need toned down accordingly due it Athel being a skirmish game.

Title: Re: Athel Loren: Hired Swords & Dramatis Personae
Post by: Master on June 20, 2009, 02:11:22 PM

Ok, we can keep the veil. We will need to playtest it though, in my gaming group terrain is always placed so you cannot shoot at eachother from game start though.

Everyone wanting hunch? Well don't they anyway, personally I think it is one of the best skills out there.

Dryad, sure she could pop out of a forest. But well, I'm not sure what to take away as I don't want to increase her cost. Perhaps reduce her toughness by 1?

Create forest spell. I like, I'd also like a spell that makes the caster or a target within 2" move through forest, IE he could move to another forest on the table.

By the way, thanks for the responses dabank, it gave us something to work with.

Title: Re: Athel Loren: Hired Swords & Dramatis Personae
Post by: ANSWER_MOD_DABANK on June 20, 2009, 06:41:24 PM

Quote from: Master on June 20, 2009, 02:11:22 PM

Ok, we can keep the veil. We will need to playtest it though, in my gaming group terrain is always placed so you cannot shoot at eachother from game start though.



By the way, thanks for the responses dabank, it gave us something to work with.

Master, Thanks. I want to comment more but I am working on a seperate project that is keeping me from this. Don't forget not everyone plays like you and something will need noted in the rules accordingly as you and I both know someone will attempt to "abuse"this skill and piss everyone else off. LOL. There is always one or two of these people in each gaming group (normally)

I am writing a complete skirmish game from beginning to end and some of the things you guys are going through are things I have already had happen or I am trying to work through also. Trust me on the need to spell things out. It is very time consuming but even with the group we had there were "questions" with rules.

Title: Re: Athel Loren: Hired Swords & Dramatis Personae
Post by: StyrofoamKing on June 21, 2009, 06:43:53 AM

Well, even with cover, the firing hero had enough snipers with 'trick shot' that the cover meant nothing. And the player hadn't started yet, so it's not like he could declare them as 'hidden' yet.

As far as the veil, I'd have to word it carefully to make it not QUITE 'hidden.'  Although, if it was used with hunch, wouldn't it only protect 2 other figures?  Does 12" seem that rough? Anything below 6" seems absurd to me, and not worth taking.

Dryad: Looking at the actual WFB dryad, I notice that the actual dryad has m5 and i6, but the way you have it now looks good.  Making the ward stack with dodge and step aside would not have occured to me, but it's a good way of making sure that they don't stack TOO strongly.

Although, considering we added in 'flammable' (and it has 1 less attack then the pitfighter, and without weapon bonuses), I think she could go with A3 without being broken.

Also, take out the 'immune to poison', I think. Trees can be poisoned quite easily (if you doubt it, look at my house plants!)

DaBank: I echo Master's sentiments... thanks for the help!

Title: Re: Athel Loren: Hired Swords & Dramatis Personae
Post by: ANSWER_MOD_DABANK on June 21, 2009, 02:17:27 PM

No worries, you guys are doing a good job so far. Keep it up! As you probably realize by now this will  be a very long process.

I believe it took Cianty almost 2 years for Border Town Burning and I am into almost a year on my project. If I didn't have to work it would be done. LOL.

Title: Re: Athel Loren: Hired Swords & Dramatis Personae
Post by: Master on June 21, 2009, 02:51:22 PM

I'm all for mimicking the WHFB dryad instead, I put it this way because that is how I remembered their stats, we can go either way I don't think it is broken.

Three attacks?

Well, it moves 50% faster and has +1 initative over the pit fighter who on the other hand has 3-4 attacks with s4-5, so you might be right that 3 s4 attacks aren't that broken.

Ok immune to poison goes.

Also, the veil would be equally useful at 8", not sure why I would place my warband more than 12" apart from the start anyway.

Title: Re: Athel Loren: Hired Swords & Dramatis Personae
Post by: ANSWER_MOD_DABANK on June 22, 2009, 11:05:19 PM

Here is a Bretonnian witch from killershrike site.

Esmerelda 
Human 60 gc to Hire +50 Warband Rating
M WS BS S T W I A LD SAVE
4" 3 4 3 4 2 4 2/3 8 -
Equipment: Dagger, Staff
Esmarelda is a witch that was cast out Brettonia several years ago and has found her way to Mordheim. She costs 30gc to upkeep. All Witch Hunter bands want her head as she has been caught by them several times but always manages to escape making them look very foolish in the process. She increases the warbands rating by 50 points.
Esmarelda will work for Mercenaries, Outlaws, Halflings, Undead, Possessed, and Skaven.
  1. Witch Fire An eerie glowing light appears around the targeted model, preventing him from hiding and granting a +1 bonus to all ranged attacks against him. In each of the targets Recovery Phases roll a d6. On a 1-3 the light flickers out, on a 4-6 it stays in place. Difficulty: 7, R: 36". 
  2. Witches Curse The targeted model is striken by clumsiness and ill luck. The model always strikes last for the remainder of the battle, after 2Handed Weapon strikes are resolved. Difficulty: 9; R: 8".
  3. Boils The targeted model must roll under its T or break out in numerous painful boils that hurt so much the model becomes temporarily Stunned regardless of Wounds. Difficulty: 8; R: 12".
  4. Magic Broom The witch perches on a broom or staff and flies 12" in any direction, up or down. If she moves into base contact with an enemy she counts as charging. If she charges a fleeing enemy, she scores 1 automatic hit, then her opponent flees again. Difficulty: 7
  6. Bewitched The targeted model must make a Ld roll on 3d6 (yes, 3d6) everytime he wants to attack the Witch for the rest of the battle. Difficulty: 6, R: 6". 
  Sprint Triple move when running or charging.