I'd consider making some of ork ships' port/starboard weapons l/f + r/f. Needs further testing, though.Interesting idea. I just thought they would need a stronger broadside firepower... but that could do it as well.
I've only played orks in battlefleet gothic a couple of times, but I feel that getting rid of their random firepower would be a mistake [...]
Maybe you could simply mess with the probabilities. Instead of rolling a d6 for instance you could roll 2d3 or 2d6 divided by two (rounded up). Either of those options would give a probability curve, where the average stays about the same, but the outliers become a rarer event.
Randomness doesn't just come from the "D6" strength of the basic gunz. The "1 impact does 2 points of damage" for the heavy gunz creates a broader probability distribution in vanilla BFG than if there were twice the number of dice being rolled with each hit doing 1 damage.That was my suggestion earlier on. Ordinary random-strength 30cm/45cm gunz could have their firepower set to a fixed low number, but each hit would do 2 points of damage. It does introduce a few new problems (gunnery chart).
Torpedoes ->Short Burn Torpedoesnormal torpedos.
Gunz now not random
Torpedoes -> half random (D3+3 sort of thing)
Turrets ->RandomNot random, they hit on 5+. 4 base on Battleships, 3 base on Kroozers [including lite kroozers], 2 on escorts.
Heavy Gunz -> Heavy guns do not get the left column shift on the gunnery
table to close range but inflict 2 damage per hit. When at range over 15 cm, they get additional right shift on the gunnery table.
@ Gunz randomness - I think SOME degree of randomness wouldn't hurt anyone, but it should be on levels varying between strong and vary strong. With no option for weak. Alternatively - gunz stop being random after you lock-on.
OR [this came to me right at this moment, so it's completely untested and not even thought through] what if gunz [and big gunz too?] would become random [-1d6 strength, for example] when ship is on special orders [other than lock on]? Instead of halving them? That would make Orks dangerously unpredictable for the enemy. In the 'it's braced, but I can't count on it being useless' sort of way. This is Orky, this is random, and is, in most cases, not a disadvantage making planning impossible. It makes life of an opponent harder though, because Ork randomness suddenly makes HIS plans harder to execute. You have your chance to call this bad idea now, because in process of writing it I've managed to convince myself it's brilliant! :D
@half random torpedos - difference between d3+3 and d6 is crucial - you can be ure you'll get something out of this ship. When you reload ordnance [especially on the cruiser] only to roll 1 on the salvo strength, you basically wasted your order, and possibly a turn. d3+3 makes torpedoes always viable, with some randomness still involved.
@turrets. True, I forgoth Ravagers have 1 turret more. 3 for them, then. I'm not sure if fleet should still have access to an additional turret upgrade, though. Needs testing if potential 4 turrets hitting on 5+ isn't too strong on a cruiser. Though today, 3 turret cruisers were able to not immediately fall apart against Tau. It didn't seem too strong.
@heavy gunz: So: range 30, left shift for close range as normal, right shift if over 15?
Markconz, does it not bother you that you have just about double the time rolling dice than other fleets? Every fleets has unpredictability in dice rolling. The game is built around that. Orks with all this randomness is just time wasting. The concept of big guns make for unpredictable built into the first die roll. If it hits, of hits hard. If not, nothing. That's the kind of unpredictability I think is fitting for Orks in this sort of game where we are representing hundreds of men firing a torpedo coming from up the command chain or tons of people with just one die roll. Why not try to find a way to keep the random feel while reducing the dice rolling? I think it can be done.
The build your own style is one I really want too but I'm sure there are a lot of Ork players out there who for the most part like the current rules and would only like to see small tweaks.
...
The real problem with the "build your own" deal is that some people who are more focused on winning than character might just pick all the best options, fully balancing things that would probably take a while...
I think that's a great balance and compromise. No random weapon batteries except front weapon batteries on capital ships. Sounds good.
As far as torpedoes, I'm not sure which roll you are referring to. You roll once to reload and that's it. Its another roll to determine how many are fired for Orks. Either way, rolling for random ordnance isn't so bad because it's nothing like every weapon battery having to be rolled.
What did you end up playing the prow weapons on the Kroozers at? Im assuming D6+2 (base) becomes 6 and then +D6 for 6+D6 Weapons batteries and 6 Heavy Weapons? Port and Starboard are then 4 Weapons batteries and 4 Heavy weapons?
Ha. We're on to something here, I think.
But, given that side gunz are currently d6+2, shouldn't they become 6, not 4? Same with front - it's d6+6 now, shouldn't it be 10+d6 if we added 4?
[Also, I'm working on full suggested profiles of some ships, will post in here soon]
| TYPE/HITS | SPEED | TURNS | SHIELDS | ARMOUR | TURRETS |
| Cruiser/10 | 20 | 45 | 1 | 6+/5+/4+ | 3 |
| ARMAMENT | RANGE/SPEED | FIREPOWER/STR | FIRE ARC | ||
| Port Heavy Gunz | 30 | 4 | Left | ||
| Port Gunz | 30 | 6 | Left | ||
| Starboard Heavy Gunz | 30 | 4 | Right | ||
| Starboard Gunz | 30 | 6 | Right | ||
| Prow Heavy Gunz | 30 | 6 | Front | ||
| Prow Gunz | 45 | 6+d6 i guess this one can be kept random, as even 7 is still solid. | Front |
| TYPE/HITS | SPEED | TURNS | SHIELDS | ARMOUR | TURRETS |
| Cruiser/10 | 20 | 45 | 1 | 6+/5+/4+ | 3 |
| ARMAMENT | RANGE/SPEED | FIREPOWER/STR | FIRE ARC | ||
| Port Launch Bay | - | 2 | - | ||
| Port Gunz | 30 | 5 | Left | ||
| Starboard Launch Bay | - | 2 | - | ||
| Starboard Gunz | 30 | 5 | Right | ||
| Prow Heavy Gunz | 30 | 6 | Front | ||
| Prow Gunz | 45 | 4+d6 | Front |
| TYPE/HITS | SPEED | TURNS | SHIELDS | ARMOUR | TURRETS |
| Escort/1 | 20 | 45 | 1 | 6+/4+ | 2 |
| ARMAMENT | RANGE/SPEED | FIREPOWER/STR | FIRE ARC | ||
| Gunz | 30 | d6+1 | L/F/R |
| TYPE/HITS | SPEED | TURNS | SHIELDS | ARMOUR | TURRETS |
| Escort/1 | 25 | 45 | 1 | 6+/4+ | 2 |
| ARMAMENT | RANGE/SPEED | FIREPOWER/STR | FIRE ARC | ||
| Heavy Gunz | 30 | 4 | Front |
| TYPE/HITS | SPEED | TURNS | SHIELDS | ARMOUR | TURRETS |
| Escort/1 | 25 | 45 | 1 | 6+/4+ | 3 |
| ARMAMENT | RANGE/SPEED | FIREPOWER/STR | FIRE ARC | ||
| Gunz | 30 | 2 | Front | ||
| Launchas | 30 | d6 | Front |
| TYPE/HITS | SPEED | TURNS | SHIELDS | ARMOUR | TURRETS |
| Escort/1 | 25 | 45 | 1 | 6+/4+ | 3 |
| ARMAMENT | RANGE/SPEED | FIREPOWER/STR | FIRE ARC | ||
| Prow Gunz | 30 | 2 | L/F/R |
| TYPE/HITS | SPEED | TURNS | SHIELDS | ARMOUR | TURRETS |
| Escort/2 | 25 | 45 | 1 | 6+/4+ | 3 |
| ARMAMENT | RANGE/SPEED | FIREPOWER/STR | FIRE ARC | ||
| Prow Gunz | 30 | 2 | L/F/R |
| TYPE/HITS | SPEED | TURNS | SHIELDS | ARMOUR | TURRETS |
| Defense/8 | 10 | Special | 1 | 5+ | 2 |
| ARMAMENT | RANGE/SPEED | FIREPOWER/STR | FIRE ARC | ||
| Gunz | 45 | d6+6 | all around | ||
| Heavy Gunz | 30 | 4 | all around | ||
| Torpedos | 30 | d6 | all around |
I have more to read of it, but so far, only the auto hit on boarding brothers me and I don't see why they should get that stock. Other than that, that's a great post!
CHARACTERS:
+40 pts, every one of them. You may buy 1 for every 500 pts. They have one re-roll base, may buy one more for +20, two more for +40.
Warboss: double boarding value.
Kaptain: +1 Ld
Big Mek: +1 shield, re-roll repairing criticals because Mek should help in actual repairs, I think...
These seem fitting.
UNIVERSAL RULES:
All Ahead Full: Ork ships automatically pass Ld test required to go on All Ahead Full order. Ork ships may only move 2D6 on All Ahead Full special orders. Note that vessels equipped with Soopa Engines ignore this rule and will travel the full 4d6 on All Ahead Full special orders as normal.
Anything but +2d6. Its absolutely pointless to go AAF even when its an automatic order. Even +4d3 would be more acceptable but +3d6 should be the minimum AAF for any ship (even transports can do that ::) )
Boarding: Ork ships add +1 to their boarding value.
So they get a +1 to the die roll and +1 to their boarding value?
Turrets: Ork Turrets hit only on roll of 5+. Note that when shooting at ordnance that is only hit on a roll of 6, Ork Turrets need 6 to hit.
Ramming: Ork vessels noted to have Rams inflict one automatic point of damage when ramming, before normal damage rolls are made. How come Imperials have bonuses to ramming while Orks don't ;)
Klaws: Klaws are unaffected by special orders of any kind but cannot be used by capital ships if they are crippled. Any time the ship equipped with Klaws moves in base contact with any one enemy ship during the movement phase, it may immediately stop its movement. If it does, it must attempt to board it this turn.I didn't want to make it copy-paste of Tyranid claws as it was in Clanz list. I felt that upgrade helping in coordination of ramming and boarding would be more useful than one more way to deal damage.
The Tyranid version allows for the grab to fail too.
Ork Escorts: Get a free escort ship if they roll ld 5 or 6. Get +1 ld when in squadron of 6 or more. Squadron size 3-10
Gunz: If firepower is random, it's rolled each time gun is fired.
Heavy Gunz: Heavy guns do not get the left column shift on the gunnery table to close range but inflict 2 damage per hit. They suffer from an extra right column shift when firing over 15 cm. I too think that left shift for close range would be an overkill.[/color]
Heavy guns inflict 2 damage per hit. They suffer from a right column shift when firing. There much more concise. within 15cm they get a right and a left column shift, canceling each other, and 16-30cm they get a left shift.
Launchas: The strength of a salvo from a torpedolauncha is generated randomly each time it is fired. Ork ships in squadrons may never combine their torpedoes into larger salvoes.
Zzap Gunz: Lances. After shooting, place blast marker touching back of your base.
Launch Bays: Equipped with Fighta bommas and Assault boats, If random, count attack craft limit for highest value. Orks like close combat - a-boats as standard seem to reflect it quite well.
CHARACTER UPGRADES: Unlike upgrades listed near ship entry, these can only be taken by ships carrying characters. Every re-roll a character has allows you to buy one of these (each upgrade can be bought only once per ship):
-Extra Turrets: ship increases its turret value by +2, up to maximum of 6. +20 pts. if you REALLY need to have extremely ordnance-resistant ship. It takes a character upgrade slot, though.
-Mega armoured boarding parties: +1 to boarding actions and hit&run results, -1 to enemy hit&run result. +15 pts.
-Extra power field: +1 shield, can be combined with Kustom Force Fields, +20 pts.
So Kustom plus this would be d3+1? and adding a mek would be d3+2?
-Mad Meks: repairs criticals on 4+, +20 pts.
-More Dakka: ship may re-roll strength one weapon per turn. +10 pts simpler than separate upgrades for gunz, lances and torps...
-Grot riggers: +1 Ld when attempting to reload ordnance. +15 pts used to be called looted torpedos in BFG:R. But as it also seemed to work on launch bays...
KLAN UPGRADES:
Any capital ship may take one of those:
Goffs: +1 to boarding, +1Ld to ramming attempts. +20 pts
Evil Sunz: +5 cm speed +20
Bad Moonz: +1 Ld when reloading ordnance. +15pts They're rich. They can afford all the fancy stuff like fuel and torpedos ;)
More Dakka would probably be more fitting here.
Deathskulls: may buy one more character upgrade than usual. That means ships with no character on board can still buy 1. +15
Shouldn't this be free, or 'for the cost listed'?
Blood Axes: Random Imperial refit. +20
Snakebites: Only Roks, Hulks and Escorts. +1 Ld when bracing for impact. [free]
Any escort squadron may take one of those:
Goffs: +1 to boarding, +1Ld to ramming attempts. +20 pts
Evil Sunz: +5 cm speed +20
Bad Moonz: +1 Ld when reloading ordnance. +15
More Dakka again
Deathskulls: not sure.
May take one additional escort re-fit for its listed cost?
Blood Axes: Up to half of squadron may be imperial escorts. They still have Ork Ld. [free]
Snakebites: Only Roks, Hulks and Escorts. +1 Ld when bracing for impact. [free]
Kill Kroozer:
165 pts
TYPE/HITS SPEED TURNS SHIELDS ARMOUR TURRETS Cruiser/10 20 45 1 6+/5+/4+ 3 ARMAMENT RANGE/SPEED FIREPOWER/STR FIRE ARC Port Heavy Gunz 30 4 Left Port Gunz 30 6 Left Starboard Heavy Gunz 30 4 Right Starboard Gunz 30 6 Right Prow Heavy Gunz 30 6 Front Prow Gunz 45 6+d6 i guess this one can be kept random, as even 7 is still solid. Front
Ork Kill Kroozer is equipped with Ram. As standard. Makes people want to ram if they already paid for bonus.
An Ork Kill kroozer may replace its prow heavy gunz battery with a torpedo launcha
(speed 30cm, Strength D6+2) for +10 points. If this option is taken, the kroozer may carry
boarding torpedoes (speed 20cm, Strength D6+2) for +5 points. It may also
replace its port and starboart heavy gunz for D6 torpedoes for no cost.
Alternatively, it may replace its port and starboard heavy gunz batteries with str2 Zzap Gunz with range 30 for +20 pts.
It may also replace its prow heavy gunz with str2 range 30 Zzap Gunz for +5 pts. Above upgrades allow you to turn Kroozer into torpedo or lance-boat. Separating lance upgrade from characters would make people actually take it from time to time, as now it tends to beovershadowed by clearly superior options.
Ork Kill Kroozer may be equipped with Soopa Boostas for +25 pts. the ship gains +5cm speed, and it rolls 4D6cm when on All Ahead Full special orders. i think, and correct me if I'm wrong, that this version is in most cases more desirable than sacrificing firepower to get it.
Ork Kroozer may be equipped with Kustom Force Field for +15 pts. It replaces its shields value with d3, rolled at the beginning of its every turn, before orders are declared. More Orky than +1 shield. Yeah, from time to time upgrade does nothing, but it doesn't render ship useless.
Ork Kill Kroozer may be equipped with Klaws for +10 points. For fans of boarding actions.
Terror Ship:
185 pts
TYPE/HITS SPEED TURNS SHIELDS ARMOUR TURRETS Cruiser/10 20 45 1 6+/5+/4+ 3 ARMAMENT RANGE/SPEED FIREPOWER/STR FIRE ARC Port Launch Bay - 2 - Port Gunz 30 5 Left Starboard Launch Bay - 2 - Starboard Gunz 30 5 Right Prow Heavy Gunz 30 6 Front Prow Gunz 45 4+d6 Front
Ork Terror Ship is equipped with Ram.
An Ork Terror Ship may replace its prow heavy gunz battery with a torpedo launcha
(speed 30cm, Strength D6+2) for +10 points. If this option is taken, the kroozer may carry
boarding torpedoes (speed 20cm, Strength D6+2) for +5 points.
It may also replace its prow heavy gunz with str2 range 30 Zzap Gunz for +5 pts.
Ork Terror Ship may be equipped with Soopa Boostas for +25 pts.
It may be equipped with Kustom Force Field for +15 pts. It replaces its shields value with d3, rolled at the beginning of its every turn, before orders are declared.
Ork Kill Kroozer may be equipped with Klaws for +10 points.
Onslaught Attack Ship:
30 pts
TYPE/HITS SPEED TURNS SHIELDS ARMOUR TURRETS Escort/1 20 45 1 6+/4+ 2 ARMAMENT RANGE/SPEED FIREPOWER/STR FIRE ARC Gunz 30 d6+1 L/F/R
May exchange 1 firepower for Soopa Boostas for +5 pts. given that they also increase speed in this version, a slight point increase.
I've given it L/F/R guns to redefine its role a bit. With Savage having 30cm rang, it seemed like a superior option in most respects when fightinc capital ships, so L/F/R guns are supposed to help Onslaught fight more nimble targets, namely enemy escorts. As escorts are in general fragile, random firepower seemed ok - large squadron still rolls a lot of dice, and even low result is potentially lethal.
Savage Gunship:
35 pts
TYPE/HITS SPEED TURNS SHIELDS ARMOUR TURRETS Escort/1 25 45 1 6+/4+ 2 ARMAMENT RANGE/SPEED FIREPOWER/STR FIRE ARC Heavy Gunz 30 4 Front
Savage Gunship has Soopa Boostas. Speed bonus is already taken into account.
No real changes here, just a point adjustment due to extra speed and range.
Ravager Attack Ship:
40 pts
TYPE/HITS SPEED TURNS SHIELDS ARMOUR TURRETS Escort/1 25 45 1 6+/4+ 3 ARMAMENT RANGE/SPEED FIREPOWER/STR FIRE ARC Gunz 30 2 Front Launchas 30 d6 Front
May exchange 1 firepower for Soopa Boostas for +5 pts.
Except for turrets, no change. If you want random torpedos, its solid ship.
Brute Ram Ship:
25 pts
TYPE/HITS SPEED TURNS SHIELDS ARMOUR TURRETS Escort/1 25 45 1 6+/4+ 3 ARMAMENT RANGE/SPEED FIREPOWER/STR FIRE ARC Prow Gunz 30 2 L/F/R
rolls 4d6 for ramming damage.
May exchange 1 firepower for Soopa Boostas for +5 pts.
May buy Ram for +10 pts.
Added ram option. It seems fitting ;)
Grunt Assault Ship:
40 pts
TYPE/HITS SPEED TURNS SHIELDS ARMOUR TURRETS Escort/2 25 45 1 6+/4+ 3 ARMAMENT RANGE/SPEED FIREPOWER/STR FIRE ARC Prow Gunz 30 2 L/F/R
Boarding value 4, Cannot Come to New Heading.
May exchange 1 firepower for Soopa Boostas for +5 pts. didn't have this option, i think it could use it...
May buy Klaws for +10 pts.
Added klaws option, second hit [it's a large ship, after all and option for Boostas.
Rok:
80 pts
TYPE/HITS SPEED TURNS SHIELDS ARMOUR TURRETS Defense/8 10 Special 1 5+ 2 ARMAMENT RANGE/SPEED FIREPOWER/STR FIRE ARC Gunz 45 d6+6 all around Heavy Gunz 30 4 all around Torpedos 30 d6 all around
Upgraded Heavy Gunz range and turrets value. Apart from that, I think it seemed solid.
I would consider just adding the Soopa boostas as a purchasable upgrade to all of them without removing anything.
SHIPS I'M NOT SURE WHAT TO DO WITH AND WHY:
Battleships: They as of now, have just 2 more hits than a Kroozer. Weapons and other stats seem ok, but I think they should be tougher somehow...
These are about the only good ships Orks have. They actually have sufficient gunz to hit something ::).
Hammer: Kroozer with battleship's weapons. Another reason I think battleships need rethinking - it's not really that more fragile than them, while being cheaper.
Zukov's Klaw: Still need to read into its rules in detail.
Basha Lite Kroozer: 6 hits, while normal kroozer has 10. And it moves like normal kroozer. It either needs more mobility or more toughness.
Its a poor point filler, this really shouldn't exist :/.
Hulks: I'm not touching these. They seem to work on their own...
FLEET STRUCTURE:
I'd leave Klanz fleet as it is, apart from adding Kaptains and Meks as character options. I'd throw out WAAGH list - Klanz should take its place when it comes to representing hure Ork forces.
Pirate list: Remove cruiser cap. Can only buy as many different Klan upgrades it has characters. Or even limit to just one Klan? A bit too restrictive, I think.
This may need some work, the fleet structure in the klans list is horrible at best.
Heavy Gunz: Heavy guns do not get the left column shift on the gunnery table to close range but inflict 2 damage per hit. They suffer from an extra right column shift when firing over 15 cm. I too think that left shift for close range would be an overkill.
Heavy guns inflict 2 damage per hit. They suffer from a right column shift when firing. There much more concise. within 15cm they get a right and a left column shift, canceling each other, and 16-30cm they get a left shift.Careful. There might actually be a difference between those 2 wordings if BFG:R has the same rules RE: firing sunward.
Any firing conducted towards the sunward table edge doubles the column shifts for long and short range. At long range (over 30cm) the powerful photosphere blinds long range sensors, so take two column shifts right on the Gunnery table instead of one. At short range (15cm or under) targets are "silhouetted" instead, so make two column shifts left.If you're using the "no range modifier at close range, right shift when firing over 15cm" wording then when fighting sunward the heavy guns receives no range modifier at <15cm.
Anything but +2d6. Its absolutely pointless to go AAF even when its an automatic order. Even +4d3 would be more acceptable but +3d6 should be the minimum AAF for any ship (even transports can do that )
So they get a +1 to the die roll and +1 to their boarding value?
The Tyranid version allows for the grab to fail too.
So Kustom plus this would be d3+1? and adding a mek would be d3+2?
More Dakka would probably be more fitting here.
Shouldn't this be free, or 'for the cost listed'?
May take one additional escort re-fit for its listed cost?might work.
I would consider just adding the Soopa boostas as a purchasable upgrade to all of them without removing anything.
These are about the only good ships Orks have. They actually have sufficient gunz to hit something .Let's leave them as they are, then, with slight tweaks such as adjusting turret values and big gun range. Might work well enough.
Its a poor point filler, this really shouldn't exist :/.
This may need some work, the fleet structure in the klans list is horrible at best.
QuoteThe Tyranid version allows for the grab to fail too.
Requires Ld test, maybe? simple 4+ seems too random to rely on it, and in case of Ld you can always use a re-roll. It may use the same modifiers as ramming, too.
I would think that Traktor beams would fit this ideal better, with klaws remaining the same.QuoteIts a poor point filler, this really shouldn't exist :/.
I too have a burning urge just to drop this thing altogether, but maybe we'll figure something out... Just giving it 90 turn would make it usable, but it's more than anything else in the fleet... We could've blame it on combination of cruiser drives and smaller mass...
Well that does go counter to the existing fluff too. Why not make them 8 hits?
| TYPE/HITS | SPEED | TURNS | SHIELDS | ARMOUR | TURRETS |
| Battleship/12 | 20 | 45 | 2 | 6+/5+ | 4 |
| ARMAMENT | RANGE/SPEED | FIREPOWER/STR | FIRE ARC | ||
| Prow Gunz | 45 | d6+6 | Front | ||
| Prow Torpedos | 30 | d6+4 | Front | ||
| Dorsal Launch Bay | - | d3+1 | - | ||
| Port Gunz | 30 | 6 | Left | ||
| Starboard Gunz | 30 | 6 | Right | ||
| Port Heavy Gunz | 30 | 6 | Left | ||
| Starboard Heavy Gunz | 30 | 6 | Right | ||
| Port Launch Bay | - | 2 | - | ||
| Starboard Launch Bay | - | 2 | - |
| TYPE/HITS | SPEED | TURNS | SHIELDS | ARMOUR | TURRETS |
| Battleship/12 | 20 | 45 | 2 | 6+/5+ | 4 |
| ARMAMENT | RANGE/SPEED | FIREPOWER/STR | FIRE ARC | ||
| Prow Gunz | 45 | d6+6 | Front | ||
| Prow Lances | 45 | d3+2 | Front | ||
| Dorsal Launch Bay | - | d3+1 | - | ||
| Port Gunz | 30 | 10 | Left | ||
| Starboard Gunz | 30 | 10 | Right | ||
| Port Heavy Gunz | 30 | 6 | Left | ||
| Starboard Heavy Gunz | 30 | 6 | Right |
| TYPE/HITS | SPEED | TURNS | SHIELDS | ARMOUR | TURRETS |
| Battleship/12 | 25 | 45 | 2 | 6+/5+ | 4 |
| ARMAMENT | RANGE/SPEED | FIREPOWER/STR | FIRE ARC | ||
| Prow Gunz | 45 | d6+6 | Front | ||
| Prow Bombardment Cannon | 30 | 6 | Front | ||
| Dorsal Launch Bay | - | d3+1 | - | ||
| Port Gunz | 30 | 8 | Left | ||
| Starboard Gunz | 30 | 8 | Right | ||
| Port Heavy Gunz | 30 | 6 | Left | ||
| Starboard Heavy Gunz | 30 | 6 | Right |
| TYPE/HITS | SPEED | TURNS | SHIELDS | ARMOUR | TURRETS |
| Battleship/12 | 25 | 45 | 2 | 6+/5+ | 4 |
| ARMAMENT | RANGE/SPEED | FIREPOWER/STR | FIRE ARC | ||
| Prow Gunz | 45 | d6+6 | Front | ||
| Prow Heavy Gunz | 30 | 6 | Front | ||
| Dorsal Launch Bay | - | d3+1 | - | ||
| Port Gunz | 30 | 8 | Left | ||
| Starboard Gunz | 30 | 8 | Right | ||
| Port Heavy Gunz | 30 | 6 | Left | ||
| Starboard Heavy Gunz | 30 | 6 | Right |
Pff. I would never let any Xeno fleet be neglected ;)
Entire fleet list is, at this point, too long to post. So instead of dividing it between few uberlong posts I'll just list the changes made from my previous version:
MEK: re-roll repairing criticals. If you rolled more 6's than needed to repair all current criticals, repair 1 lost hit (only 1, regardless of how many extra 6's were rolled). Reason: extra shield together with other upgrades got kinda crazy on Battleships. This version seems, well more meky.
Change it to something like: Attempts to repair critical damage on the MEK's ship receive an additional D6. If the ship has no critical hits against it you may attempt to repair 1 point of damage in the same way as critical hits. You may never repair more than one damage per turn and the ship may never exceed its maximum hit points.
If you do the re-roll repair dice that would be fine but with the damage repair rule you have that makes it way too easy to repair damage, especially on the battleships.
AAF: 3d6 base. Not sure about it, though.
Orks should be encouraged to go AAF, I find its rarely worth going AAF tho +2D6 just isn't enough on average to function well.
Boarding: +1 boarding roll base. Not value. It was a mistake.
KLAN UPGRADES:
Any capital ship may take one of those:
Goffs: +1 to boarding, +1Ld to ramming attempts. +20 pts
Evil Sunz: +5 cm speed +20
That's not a lot for 20 points.
Bad Moonz: May re-roll firepower of one weapon per turn. Cumulative with More Dakka [can't re-roll same weapon twice] +15pts As per suggestion
This sounds ok.
Deathskulls: may buy one more character upgrade than usual. That means ships with no character on board can still buy 1. +15
So Im paying to be able to pay for an upgrade, feels like tax time :/.
Blood Axes: Random Imperial refit. +20
Snakebites: Only Roks, Hulks and Escorts. +1 Ld when bracing for impact. [free]
Any escort squadron may take one of those:
Goffs: +1 to boarding, +1Ld to ramming attempts. +20 pts
Evil Sunz: +5 cm speed +20
Bad Moonz: May re-roll firepower of one weapon per turn. Escorts with no random weapon increase their firepower by 1. +15pts As per suggestion
Deathskulls: Nothing works, damnit! +1 turret? Random ork refit from Armada? 5+ side armour? Hey, i kinda like the last one.
How about Increase all armor facings +1 to a maximum of 6+? Its just a slight boost but it would also work for capitol ships and then I don't feel like Im getting my yearly fleecing.
Blood Axes: Up to half of squadron may be imperial escorts. They still have Ork Ld. [free]
Snakebites: Only Roks, Hulks and Escorts. +1 Ld when bracing for impact. [free]
Deathskull escorts are bit problematic.
Klaws are back to their Klanz-Nid-Copy version.
New Klaws are now called Traktor Fields.
Everything that could take Klaws before now can take both, 10 pts each.
Id call them something like Heavy Traktor beams or something, keeping standard traktor fields the same as that's a free upgrade fix for people that got shipped large bases instead of small.
More to come.
Pff. I would never let any Xeno fleet be neglected ;)
Entire fleet list is, at this point, too long to post. So instead of dividing it between few uberlong posts I'll just list the changes made from my previous version:
MEK: re-roll repairing criticals. If you rolled more 6's than needed to repair all current criticals, repair 1 lost hit (only 1, regardless of how many extra 6's were rolled). Reason: extra shield together with other upgrades got kinda crazy on Battleships. This version seems, well more meky.
Change it to something like: Attempts to repair critical damage on the MEK's ship receive an additional D6. If the ship has no critical hits against it you may attempt to repair 1 point of damage in the same way as critical hits. You may never repair more than one damage per turn and the ship may never exceed its maximum hit points.
If you do the re-roll repair dice that would be fine but with the damage repair rule you have that makes it way too easy to repair damage, especially on the battleships.
Agreed.
AAF: 3d6 base. Not sure about it, though.
Orks should be encouraged to go AAF, I find its rarely worth going AAF tho +2D6 just isn't enough on average to function well.
I agree. 2D6 with no Ld test is still not all that great considering the 1/2 firepower. I am still in favor of making it 4D6 like everyone else and +2Ld for AAF tests.
Boarding: +1 boarding roll base. Not value. It was a mistake.
KLAN UPGRADES:
Any capital ship may take one of those:
Goffs: +1 to boarding, +1Ld to ramming attempts. +20 pts
Evil Sunz: +5 cm speed +20
That's not a lot for 20 points.
I believe it is +10pts for Tyranids. Why not just make it that?
Bad Moonz: May re-roll firepower of one weapon per turn. Cumulative with More Dakka [can't re-roll same weapon twice] +15pts As per suggestion
This sounds ok.
Deathskulls: may buy one more character upgrade than usual. That means ships with no character on board can still buy 1. +15
So Im paying to be able to pay for an upgrade, feels like tax time :/.
Blood Axes: Random Imperial refit. +20
Snakebites: Only Roks, Hulks and Escorts. +1 Ld when bracing for impact. [free]
Any escort squadron may take one of those:
Goffs: +1 to boarding, +1Ld to ramming attempts. +20 pts
Evil Sunz: +5 cm speed +20
Bad Moonz: May re-roll firepower of one weapon per turn. Escorts with no random weapon increase their firepower by 1. +15pts As per suggestion
Deathskulls: Nothing works, damnit! +1 turret? Random ork refit from Armada? 5+ side armour? Hey, i kinda like the last one.
How about Increase all armor facings +1 to a maximum of 6+? Its just a slight boost but it would also work for capitol ships and then I don't feel like Im getting my yearly fleecing.
I think that would work well actually. I would make for a more tanky Ork fleet. I love it.
Blood Axes: Up to half of squadron may be imperial escorts. They still have Ork Ld. [free]
Snakebites: Only Roks, Hulks and Escorts. +1 Ld when bracing for impact. [free]
Deathskull escorts are bit problematic.
Klaws are back to their Klanz-Nid-Copy version.
New Klaws are now called Traktor Fields.
Everything that could take Klaws before now can take both, 10 pts each.
Id call them something like Heavy Traktor beams or something, keeping standard traktor fields the same as that's a free upgrade fix for people that got shipped large bases instead of small.
True.
More to come.
Firstly, where do I find the Core rules for BFG:R ? I've found several different versions of lists and such, and can take it that this is the most recent one, but knowing what has changed from the printed copy of the rules would be a big help too. Perhaps there needs to be a "Welcome to BFG, here's where to find things" thread stickied to help relative newcomers like myselfHey,
Note that vessels equipped with Soopa EnginesSo, what is "this rule"? The 3D6 move rule, the auto pass ld rule, or both?
ignore this rule and will travel the full 4d6 on All Ahead Full special orders as normal.
Zzap Gunz: Lances. After shooting, place blast marker touching back of your baseDo you mean "a blastmarker"?
Launch Bays: Equipped with Fighta bommas and Assault boats, If random, count attack craft limit forI think this should be
highest value.
More Dakka: ship may re-roll strength one weapon per turn. +10 ptsSo the ship may reroll weapons with strength 1 each turn? Or the ship may reroll the strength of one weapon each turn.
When Leadership values are generated for the Ork fleet, Battleship X can opt to swap Leadership ratings with a Kill kroozer or Terror ship to represent the warlord dragooning the best crew in the fleet aboard his vessel.
0-5 Nob : +20 pts, comes with one re-roll, can’t buy more. No additional rules. Unlocks one characterWhat does "unlock one character re-roll as normal" mean? It is meant to be "one character upgrade"?
re-roll as normal.
Launch Bays: Equipped with Fighta bommas and Assault boats, If random, count highest value forI thing that sentence needs to the end in the word "limit".
attack craft.
First of all, due to some clans being superior for escorts, I'd give them following restriction: To take a clan upgrade anywhere, you need a capital ship with a character with said clan upgrade. So, to take Evil Sunz ramship squadron, you need at least an Evil Sunz Basha with Nob in the same fleet. That solves a problem of 'capitals from one clan, escorts from the other' lists.Okay, fair enough. That makes sense. A clan needs a leader, so to get a clan in your list, you need a character somewhere.
Due to the nature of character upgrades, every character is assigned to a ship in stage of list building.Why is this nessesary? I do not see why this should be so.
Every character comes with 1 re-roll as standard. He may buy additional 1 re-roll for +20 pts, or 2 for 40 pts.Ouch :'(. That really hurts, like, deep inside.
Re-rolls are usable for character's own ship or any ship or squadron from the same Klan within 15 cm. Ships with no Klan may only use re-rolls from other ships with no Klan.
"Ork vessel with a character on board that fails a re-roll may attempt to use another re-roll, but by doing so automatically inflicts one hit&run attack against itself"? Simpler that Chaos version, but I think it has to be - with lots of re-rolls and multiple characters we'd get Ork fleeet shooting at itself for half a battle ;)
Orks ships are often ill-kempt, unreliable rust buckets kept in operation only by the constant efforts of mekboyz and their gretchin slaves. Ork vessels use all the normal rules for fleers except where stated here.Aside from the "fleers" spelling, this is a subtle way to stick it to the other fleets. I always read it as
Orks ships are often ill-kempt, unreliable rust buckets kept in operation only by the constant efforts of mekboyz and their gretchin slaves. As such, they are not to different from the ships of the Imperium and Ork vessels use all the normal rules for fleets except where stated here.
Brace for Impact works normallyMissing space before Each
against attacks by Klaws.Each
ORK CHARACTERSShould be variety
Orks have a variery of
BigMekSpace between Big and Mek
Evil Sunz: +5 cm speed +10should be +10 pts.
Characters can either bosspole their own ship, or ship in 15 cm. If it's from different Klan, hit&run is with +1 modifier.I would like this to be "their own ship or a ship that is part of the same squadron and within 15cm". I do not think, but haven't checked, that different clans cannot be part of the same squadron, so the cross-clan hit&run bonus seems redundant.
In case of bosspoling escort ships, I'd do it like that: hit&run hits random ship in squadron within 15 cm of the character himself. If character is on the ship belonging to a squadron, he too can be randomly whacked. It will help with taking sacrificial Brutes, and make Nob in escort squadron a viable option to give them more or less reliable leadership.
Large Bad Moon Ravager squadron +Nob with riggers grows to be a powerful [though expensive] option.The Goff Grunts do not really need the Mega Armour boarding parties. Being Goff means +1 boarding and +1 LD to ram. The Mega Armour would only work on the Nob's ship, not on every ship in the squadron.
Same for Goff Grunts with mega boarding parties.
Orks still have +1 to boarding, I was sure I already corrected this ;)You did in the old document, but the error crept back into the new prettier document. :)