Specialist Arms Forum
Warmaster => Warmaster Revolution => Topic started by: Hammerskelp on January 20, 2017, 11:24:38 PM
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Starting to digest WMR in a bit more detail. Four of us will try our first game next week.
Looking good so far...... :)
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When a combat is unresolved I can see that a number of effects from the previous combat carry over into the next player's turn. (Outstanding hits from combat. Pursuit bonuses for victory & distance. Stand and shoot damage inflicted as part of an advance......)
What about effects that previously lasted for the whole 'combat-phase'?
For example, WAAAGH!
My poor tier3-army orcs are going to run out of steam half way through the party.
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Thinking it through on my own, while I'm disadvantaged when I attack, I should gain when I'm attacked.
(ie: If I'm attacked and can hold on for two rounds of combat I might be able to throw in reinforcements and a Waaagh! when its my turn.)
One of the many little changes that will impact the game. Probably in a good way!
Thoughts?
-- Hammerskelp
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Unresolved Combats are a bit groggy first but alright after. use some different colored dice, discuss in your group if you want to do the "new stand and shoot" and the end of the phase. This way you have only pursuit/multiple and hits to record.
Spells like the waaaagh are more a bit tactical, like you said using it as a defender can be quite surprising.
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Personally I don't have a problem with the combat enhancement spells wearing off. Helps game balance. No longer have the uber-unit buffed up with a Rage of Chaos and accompanying terror-mounted character sweeping all before it. Fatigue would occur and it gives the opponent a (realistic?) chance to commit reinforcements to the fight.
In terms of keeping track of the situation at the end of the combat phase, I use D12 to record casualties carried over. I then place GW scatter dice with their arrow pointing to show which way the combat is flowing and so which side is pursuing. And if it's over 3cm, for example, I place a D4 next to it, or something similar.
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I use D12 to record casualties carried over.
A D4 should be enough, because you remove hole stands before the round ends.
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Understood, but D12 is my usual way of recording casualties for units, so I just leave them in place after removing stands. Then the D4 is different enough to remind me that it's the pursuit bonus(es).
And I'm a convert to big dice. So much easier to see in middle age!
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Should someone make up some markers? charge, retreat, pursuit? I already have a couple ideas.
I finally tried out the new combat system and my gosh could it get confusing fast, so many units piling on!
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Actually you need only two kinds of markers - for wounds and for bonuses when pusruing. Easiest way is to use dice of two different colours. I use standard GW wound markers for wounds and dice or arrow-shaped markers with numners on them (from some old GW marker set) for the pursues.
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I use the same wound markers (GF9) that I use in all games requiring this kind of book keeping. Bonus attacks, usually not more than one or two per unit, I mark with glass beads.
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just made these.
I will glue them to chip board (heavy heavy cardstock), cut them out. Then I will spray paint the other side to match and lastly, spray a mat protective coat all over.
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I've got a few of the kallistra Impaled
http://www.kallistra.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=286 (http://www.kallistra.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=286)
That I'm planning to use for carried over casualties. Skull dice for during combat and these for carried over wounds.
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CJ, cool markers. I think more sutable text for the arrows is "advance" and based on my experience, the number on it, representing attack bonuses from previus combat round is very helpful.
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These are merely my own helpers. Everyone will have a differrent want. :). I wanted to record the chargers and just the distance retreated. Everyone else will be a pursuer with the bonus' via the retreat distance. I didnt think a number would be a good idea on there as that would change per situation, in the open? Chariots? Etc. I hope to test them this morning. I played one battle and developed what i think i wanted and today i should be able to figure out what i really want.
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I think I just broke it. :P See attached image.
to explain, the knights had to fight one round of combat with the harpies against a gyrocopter to then advance up the hill against the Dwarf Warriors. The spawn and Chaos warriors had to fight 2 rounds of combat against a Dwarf slayer unit to kill it off and then advance up the hill into the flank of the Dwarf Warriors.
With 2 rounds maximum, the Knights still have 1 round of combat in them but I wanted to let the spawn setup behind them and get some more attacks per the Chaos warrior stand on the flank. Combat is done for everyone but the Knights and the Dwarf warriors per the new 2 round maximum, so now what? Can anyone still fight?
Thank you.
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If I'm getting it right you didn't break it, just didn't do it right.
First - The two rounds of combat count for fights againts the same enemy. After the advance, you have another two rounds of combat. So during one combat phase, one uint can easily fight four rounds of combat- 2rounds, advance, another 2 rounds.
Second - after your unit advance into new enemy, you have to resolve the new combat immediately and only after that you can move to another combat.
So - Supposing you choose to reslove the knights and harpies vs gyro first - After destroying the Gyro, your knights advanced into the Dwarf warriors and should have fought another two rounds of combat. Only after that you were supposed to reslove the combat of your spawn and warriors against slayers. After wiping the slayers, they could have advanced. In case they would advanced into the dwarfs (supposing the dwarf were not destroyed fighting the knights or retreated too far away), they could have advanced into them. What happens next depends on the situation of the dwarf warriors. In case they were still fighting the knights the combat would have become unresolved and fought in opponents turn, as the dwarfs already fought the knights. In case the dwarfs beated the knights or the knights decided to fall back, the dwarfs would be unengaged and the advancing spawn and warriors would get another 2 rounds of fight against the dwarf warriors.
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Ooo, thanks for the clarification on how many rounds can be fought per turn. We've been playing 2 rounds advance [end]... the advance resolved in the opponents turn for 2 rounds...etc. this makes more sense now. Will try tomorrow night.
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So in affect, we are eliminating the possibilities of two forces being able to come together after their first combats? Ill need to play another couple of games and try again.
I did find that the markers work well for bookmarking unresolved combats. I personally like it but open for suggestions and i can repost if people want me too.
Thank you aldhick!
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ok, so what if......
the knights had only charged originally, up the hill into the Dwarf Warriors. Then the Chaos Warriors and the Spawn charge against the slayers, roll them in 2 rounds....can they then charge the flank of the Dwarf Warriors to help the Knights?
Because the new limitation I am seeing is all "Advances" or second charges, are completed immediately to the 2 round maximum.
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yes, they can. If you advance into combat that hasn't been resolved yet, the advancing unit joins in and the combat is resolved next.
An advance might initiate a new combat engagement, it
might bring the advancing unit into an existing
unfought engagement, or it might bring the advancing
unit into an engagement that has been fought but
which remains unresolved.
If advancing into an existing unfought engagement, the
advancing unit fights as part of the engagement that
turn. This means the unit fights in two separate
engagements during the same Combat phase and could,
potentially, fight up to four rounds of combat during
the turn.
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I re-read the rules today on my lunch break, figured out a bunch of stuff :)
Its always amazing to me how much I seem to miss the first time through any rulebook. What I was really missing was the fact that when a unit "advances" you must keep going with that unit until complete. That is another rule that I originally learned wrong 15+ years ago and never relearned! :/
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Great read.
I missed the rule that there are only 2 rounds of combat. So I kept fighting until one of both units was destroyed...
Thanks for pointing that out.
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I think it will take a little while to pick up on some of the small changes that don't immediately jump out at you.
For example: All advances being 20cm now. (Instead of the 20cm/10cm depending on what round your opponent was wiped.)