May 01, 2025, 05:07:04 PM

Author Topic: Not going below 1 minimum attack .... whatever situation.  (Read 8272 times)

Offline Claus

  • Warmasterplaytest team
  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 204
Not going below 1 minimum attack .... whatever situation.
« on: June 10, 2009, 07:58:37 AM »
Hello gentlemen and maybe ladies ;)

I´m thinking already some time about this one.

Why the hell don´t we have a rule telling that you never can go below 1 minimum attack...whatever close combat situation you face ?
I mean ...it´s completely nonsense being attacked and not striking back.

I also were looking at the undead army:
This army is really poor....being a mass army and having no chance to get more then 5 characters by 2.000 points.
They desperately need also the permission to get a standard hero/mumie being no wizzard and allow to give commands not having restriction of 20cm. (also the character pack is fielding riders and mumies that would allow this)

Both propositions of mine would not impact game play to much and also it would not make the army to tough.

Regards
Claus

Offline Lex

  • Global Moderator
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1451
  • I wonder...
    • Loc: Bergen op Zoom, Netherlands
    • Warmuster . BitzBox
Re: Not going below 1 minimum attack .... whatever situation.
« Reply #1 on: June 10, 2009, 09:31:54 AM »
Hello gentlemen and maybe ladies ;)

I´m thinking already some time about this one.

Why the hell don´t we have a rule telling that you never can go below 1 minimum attack...whatever close combat situation you face ?
I mean ...it´s completely nonsense being attacked and not striking back.


Actualy in friendly games I think we always have applied that rules anyway.

Offline captPiett

  • Active Member
  • *
  • Posts: 169
Re: Not going below 1 minimum attack .... whatever situation.
« Reply #2 on: June 10, 2009, 02:02:29 PM »

I also were looking at the undead army:
This army is really poor....being a mass army and having no chance to get more then 5 characters by 2.000 points.
They desperately need also the permission to get a standard hero/mumie being no wizzard and allow to give commands not having restriction of 20cm. (also the character pack is fielding riders and mumies that would allow this)

Both propositions of mine would not impact game play to much and also it would not make the army to tough.

I would heartily disagree with this... The undead army is very strong. First, their special rules allow them to ignore terrifying enemies, and if positioned correctly, the more annoying aspects of shooting (e.g. drivebacks and the subsequent breaking up of brigades). Second, all the liche priests can cast "doom and dispair" fairly easily, making it hard for the enemy to get the jump on them. Third, its a very shooty army; the skull chukkas are especially deadly since they ignore armor. Fourth, the units are cheap, which allows for wonderfully high breakpoints. The army just does not go away. Finally, they have very good offensive units, especially the chariot. As long as the undead player can get these into action while protecting enough of the fodder to avoid breaking, he has an excellent chance of winning. 5 leaders per 2K points is plenty for this purpose. Even without chariots (heresy, I know), I've been able to win with/get beaten by undead with just their cavalry (if they attack first). I own the armies my wm group plays with, and I didn't get around to purchasing/painting chariots until recently, but the undead was still(!) an army that was regularly chosen.

Besides, they have units like the sphinx and the bone giant, which are quite fun. Carrion are fun and very useful in wiping out stray units/ungaurded artillery.

The undead general just needs to establish his priorities in moving his brigades around, and keep them from straying too far afield (as with any army, really).







Offline Guthwine

  • Mod
  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 466
Re: Not going below 1 minimum attack .... whatever situation.
« Reply #3 on: June 10, 2009, 03:19:53 PM »
There is the "last stand" rule in the acient rules, where it says that a unit always fights back with 1 attack no matter what. (flank,terror, confusion, ...) I think that rule should be applicable for WM also.
Warmaster:
- Bretonia
- Dwarves
- Highelf WIP

Epic:
-Imperial Guard
-Necrons
-Space Marines WIP

Offline azrael71

  • Warmasterplaytest team
  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 896
Re: Not going below 1 minimum attack .... whatever situation.
« Reply #4 on: June 10, 2009, 04:19:41 PM »
We always play the house rule that a stand always gets 1 attack no matter what.

Offline spiritusXmachina

  • Warmasterplaytest team
  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 244
    • Loc: Austria
    • Plain of Battle - Worldwide Warmaster Campaign
Re: Not going below 1 minimum attack .... whatever situation.
« Reply #5 on: June 10, 2009, 07:09:20 PM »
As units that are attacked to the flank don't get support anymore I think that would just be fair. And at least every unit would have at least a little chance to win any combat.
Would be ok by me.
WARMASTER
Small models
Great Game!

Offline jchaos79

  • Moderator
  • Veteran member
  • *
  • Posts: 2530
    • Loc: Vigo, Galicia, Spain
    • Fortunes of war
Re: Not going below 1 minimum attack .... whatever situation.
« Reply #6 on: June 10, 2009, 07:12:36 PM »
I applied it too

Offline wmchaos2000

  • Active Member
  • *
  • Posts: 158
  • Sir Killalot II for the masses!!! /mvh ola
Re: Not going below 1 minimum attack .... whatever situation.
« Reply #7 on: June 10, 2009, 10:54:17 PM »
Never applied it, but it seems fair.

Offline captPiett

  • Active Member
  • *
  • Posts: 169
Re: Not going below 1 minimum attack .... whatever situation.
« Reply #8 on: June 11, 2009, 02:57:24 PM »
I always thought that was a rule, not just a house rule. Our group has played it that way.

Offline azrael71

  • Warmasterplaytest team
  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 896
Re: Not going below 1 minimum attack .... whatever situation.
« Reply #9 on: June 11, 2009, 03:06:13 PM »
That was how the game was taught to me.
But other glaringly obvious errors were also taught.

Offline captPiett

  • Active Member
  • *
  • Posts: 169
Re: Not going below 1 minimum attack .... whatever situation.
« Reply #10 on: June 11, 2009, 03:10:23 PM »
heh, I know what you mean... It's taken us years to get it right  :-[

So no one disagrees with my assessment of the udead? I'm surprised...

Offline wmchaos2000

  • Active Member
  • *
  • Posts: 158
  • Sir Killalot II for the masses!!! /mvh ola
Re: Not going below 1 minimum attack .... whatever situation.
« Reply #11 on: June 11, 2009, 05:24:07 PM »
I agree with you about the Undead.
I always have a hard time to get around those multiple Doom´n´Despair spells.
That and their "kittens".  :(

Offline Carrington

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 212
Re: Not going below 1 minimum attack .... whatever situation.
« Reply #12 on: June 11, 2009, 05:59:07 PM »
heh, I know what you mean... It's taken us years to get it right  :-[

So no one disagrees with my assessment of the udead? I'm surprised...

It doesn't help to have WMA/BOFA rules also floating around in the memory banks.

Perhaps I should print out the WMF rulebook on colored paper to help aid recall.

Offline Claus

  • Warmasterplaytest team
  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 204
Re: Not going below 1 minimum attack .... whatever situation.
« Reply #13 on: June 12, 2009, 12:13:47 PM »
Gentlemen ... I fully disagree with your comments on UNDEAD Army.

I played this army myself (very succesfully) and can tell you....the possibility to get 1 hero in addition is neccessary,especially if you play games below 2.000 points. (this was my first army I started playing Warmaster with.)

Undead are the only army restricted to a maximum of 5 Commanding characters when playing gamse up to 2.999 pts.....why ?
It´s not justified.

I proposed the usage of  1 additional hero (no wizzard) per 1.000 pts in order to give them the possibility go give more commands.
(maybe a hero with command value 7 only ... needs to be discussed)

I can tell you .... never won my games due to massive shooting, almost never were fielding catapults (standard troops are better), Sphinx is not worth the point value (my opinion)...4 mages gives a ratio of 2 succesfull "doom and dispair" spells per turn....don´t tell me this will prevent you from attacking.

I highly recommend to give it some playtesting.

Offline Bel

  • Moderator
  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 213
    • Loc: Somewhere in Siberia
    • PolarFox
Re: Not going below 1 minimum attack .... whatever situation.
« Reply #14 on: June 12, 2009, 01:38:45 PM »
Btw Claus how do your undead units with a minimum of  2 attacks in profile get a 0 attack value in combat unless affected by some spells? Or you mean a general situation?